classes ::: Evening_Talks_With_Sri_Aurobindo, A_B_Purani, Integral_Yoga, chapter,
children :::
branches :::
see also :::

Instances, Classes, See Also, Object in Names
Definitions, . Quotes . - . Chapters .


object:2.02 - On Letters
book class:Evening Talks With Sri Aurobindo
author class:A B Purani
subject class:Integral Yoga
class:chapter


ON BOOKS AND LETTERSII — On Letters
II — On Letters
25 SEPTEMBER 1923

C. R. Das sent a wire to Sri Aurobindo asking for a message for the paper Forward that he was bringing out from Calcutta. Sri Aurobindo dictated the following reply.

Sri Aurobindo: Such a message at present would amount to a public announcement and I do not like to make any pronouncement at present. It must be done at the proper time, because it would set in motion forces in opposition. Besides, there are other papers that have demanded similar messages and I would not know how to refuse them if I make up my mind to send you one.

Again, if I put myself out like that, it would interfere with the silent support which I am giving you. I am acting in a particular way, and if I create directly a field then the two would mutually interfere. I do not at present want to act on the physical plane as it would evoke opposition.
20 NOVEMBER 1923

One Mr. K had written some letters to Sri Aurobindo and asked for explanations of his experiences and wanted guidance. His questions were read out to Sri Aurobindo.

Sri Aurobindo: Ah, I see; he is the same man, — son of a pleader. No, he is impossible.

Disciple: There is one reply to all his questions.

Sri Aurobindo: What is it?

Disciple: God knows everything! (Laughter)

Disciple: That is a reply to all questions past, present and future. He would no longer trouble you.

Sri Aurobindo: Then better take him over under you.

(After a little pause) He is quite unprepared. The descent, if it takes place, is more likely to smash him up.

Besides, he is wrong in thinking that attraction for woman is abnormal; it is quite normal. It is a sick mind that makes him think otherwise.

When I first saw him he was quite nervous. I could see the whole being coming and entering into me.

Disciple: He says he has lost his intellectual power and will and everything else. Something must descend, he says, from Above and raise him up from his present condition.

Sri Aurobindo: It is very funny how people find a glimpse of the higher life and then go on jumping about.

Disciple: I think that before one man becomes divine, half the world will go mad. (Laughter)

But someone must ask him to find a room for himself.

Sri Aurobindo: I thought you wanted him to have a room for meditation; first handcuff him and then make him meditate!

Disciple: I am afraid he will first give a yell and then jump. (Laughter)

Disciple: How is it that the higher Light misses its way in such cases?

Sri Aurobindo: It is not exactly missing its way. It is like a force working and if somebody by chance happens to get into the circuit and if there is something in him that is responsive then he gets a glimpse. But his other parts, being not prepared, do not understand it.

I found he had some psychic glimpses here and there, but he has thoroughly collapsed now.

Disciple: I expected a madder look in his face.

Sri Aurobindo: I found it in him at the first sight.

Disciple: Even now he has some kind of force.

Sri Aurobindo: You call it force? It is not force, it is some wild intensity of weakness.
8 JANUARY 1924

A letter from Krishnashashi, who was mentally deranged, was read in which he gave various reasons why he should be permitted to come to Pondicherry. One was that he was becoming black in the colour of his body, but it was shining black! The Madrasi too has a dark complexion, so he should stay at Pondicherry!

Sri Aurobindo (after a hearty laugh) : Even in his madness he is always original! He never goes along the beaten track!

( Then about another man wanting to take up Yoga he said)

He has some easy itching for Yoga, — I mean restlessness due to something central in him wanting it. But there is something that may obstruct the Yoga.
10 JANUARY 1924

There was an article in the Forward on Manmohan Ghose's death in which it was written that "He had left behind him Barindra Kumar and Sri Aurobindo."

Sri Aurobindo (after a good laugh) : People do not understand 'leaving behind' generally refers to children and not to brothers! These newspapers write anything without proper inquiry. The age given to Manmohan is quite wrong. It is said to be the same as mine and in that case, naturally, we are twins! (Laughter)

There was reading of a letter of condolence from one Bharati from Pudukotah on Manmohan's death. The last sentence was: "Let him enjoy a long life in heaven at least."

Sri Aurobindo: He seems to be very much afraid that he might be short-lived even there! (Laughter)

Do you know this man is writing my biography — Aurobindo Vijayam — without knowing anything about my life? (Hearty laughter) I think the last scene will be one in which I shall be described as overcome by grief at Manmohan's death!
10 JULY 1924

A letter from Taraknath Das describing certain of his experiences and asking certain questions was read.

The questions were about:

Jada, Unmana, and Chaitanya Samadhi.

Cosmic emotion.

Soul-unity and its meaning.

The attitude of the soul to Shakti's work.

Sri Aurobindo: He has been progressing well and should be asked to continue till he has a glimpse of something higher than the mind.

( Sri Aurobindo then took up the question of Samadhi)

There are many ways of classification and there are no hard and fast rules. In the old way, they always classified Samadhi with regard to the Mind, — calling it Savikalpa and Nirvikalpa, or Sakalpa and Nirkalpa. All that is with reference to the Mind.

If he wants to know the meaning which Ramakrishna gave to those terms then he must find it out himself.

Disciple: Ramakrishna means by Jada the Nirvikalpa and by Chaitanya the experience of ones being floating in the ocean like a fish or like a bird flying in the infinite sky.

Sri Aurobindo: That is, again, with reference to the Mind — and mental yoga. You can classify it in different ways. But generally the classifications are based upon:

Mind, or

According to the plane — vital, physical or mental — on which it occurs, or

According to its reference to Jagrata, Swapna, and Sushupti states of consciousness (the waking, the dream state and the state of condensed consciousness).

Disciple: What is the Sushupti condition?

Sri Aurobindo: It is a state of consciousness with reference to which your mind is not awake, your mind is Sushupta — asleep — and so you do not project yourself in the external or in the internal being. But what is Sushupta to one may be consciousness to another. A man may be quite conscious in Sushupti.

Disciple: How?

Sri Aurobindo: For instance, in the Supermind all things meet. These things, Savikalpa, etc., do not apply to the Supermind.

Disciple: In the old paths they used Sushupta condition to go into the Superconscient stage, did they not?

Sri Aurobindo: That was the use of it. But then they recognised no intermediate gradations. From Mind they jumped to the Parabrahman; for them the Superconscient was the Brahman only. But the stages that you find in the Vedas and in the Upanishads after the Mind are left behind, all become lost.

Disciple: The classifications in the Upanishads confuse many people.

Sri Aurobindo: In the Upanishads it is quite different from abstract philosophy. There different men have given their own different experiences and you have to take them as experiences. For instance, I myself made different classifications of various movements and their mixture and also the mixtures of mixtures, their comparisons and subtler movements. But I have used them for my own guidance, — for personal knowledge and use. But I would not think of putting them in book-form.

These classifications are there as steps and as general guidance. Once you have the experience you can have your own classification for guidance. Of course, general things about the physical, the vital which everybody can experience and which are the same for all can be given in book-form; or when the higher experiences come, for instance, Intuition and Revelation, etc., then you can know them yourself.

Disciple: Once it seems the Divine Mother came to Ramakrishna with a golden body, and told him to take it. But he said, "No. I don't want it," and then later he said: "Suppose I kept it, then all people would rush to me."

Sri Aurobindo: Was he afraid of that? In Ramakrishna you find clear intuition, and revelations of the higher order within a limited area, — they are not of the universal kind. In this Yoga one has to go beyond conventional ideas and also to have a mind which is elastic.

In the jail I was proceeding by the old method and I found all the conventional ideas were broken. For eight or ten days all sorts of ideas, — of cruelty, hatred, and other disgusting thoughts — came till the mind ceased to give any reaction to them and then all old ideas were broken. You can't have the Higher Consciousness unless the mind is very elastic and open and receptive.

You have also to accept Asuric and Rakshasic things, get the knowledge — know what they are, and throw them away. Otherwise the ascent to the Supermind would be narrow and limited, not rich and varied and wide. But, of course, all cannot do that.
25 NOVEMBER 1924

D had written a letter to M, a disciple, on 14 November. It was meant to be read to Sri Aurobindo. D had requested Sri Aurobindo to give his views on marriage, particularly as he intended taking up the Yoga in future. He wanted to know what attitude a person intending to take up the highest spiritual life should adopt towards marriage. D admitted that he felt sex-attraction and did not want to resort merely to repression.

Sri Anrobindo: It is rather a delicate matter to answer. Perhaps the following points may be offered to him.

What is ordinarily known as sex-attraction is mainly a pull on the vital and physical planes between man and woman. This attraction, generally, gets mixed up with emotions and sentiments and is almost always mistaken for love, or psychic relation.

For those who want to give up ordinary life altogether, that is to say, for Sannyasins, etc., marriage in the ordinary sense is out of the question. Because marriage is the one thing that strongly fixes down a person to life. Woman by nature has the strongest tendency to stick to life. She, generally, pulls down the man and fixes him to life. This is especially intended by Nature for the continuance of the race and life.

There is a meeting together of the psychic of the man and of the woman, — a union of soul with soul. This, of course, is difficult to get.

The first point refers to the ordinary life in the vital and the physical planes.

In the higher life there are two types, two gradations, of meeting of man and woman. One is the psychic union, the other is the spiritual. The man of high idealism — the poet, the artist, has a developed psychic being. In the ordinary man, it is not developed. For a psychically developed man to get a woman of the right type is rather difficult. But if such a union could come about it would be a great help to both of them.

Disciple: But his question would be how to find out the right sort of woman for marriage.

Sri Aurobindo: There is no hard and fast rule in these things. It is all to be found out by an inner perception. It is not a science, it is an art.

Even when the union of the psychic takes place between the two, the other parts, the mental, the vital and the physical of one may clash with that of the other and the gain of the psychic being may be spoiled by this disharmony. But if the psychic being dominates in both then these difficulties may slowly clear up. The spiritual relation between man and woman is the most difficult to achieve. The man seeking the higher divine life, the seeker after Divine Consciousness and the Truth, — who is Purusha, — if he meets the woman of the right type — the woman who is his Shakti — then his spiritual life, the life which he is to manifest, is enriched and becomes full. In this case also there is the psychic union between the two.

In the case of those who have the psychic union of the proper kind to start with, the spiritual relation may gradually develop and manifest itself.

In the spiritual union, the woman who is the Shakti must be really a Power — that is to say, a powerful personality who can receive the help from the Purusha in the proper way. Each must be of real help to the other: this relation is the most difficult to attain. These difficulties come to the sadhak; to the Siddha, the perfected soul, there is no difficulty. He knows fully well what is to be manifested. If his Shakti is there he knows where she is and he will get her.

Disciple: Is the Shakti necessary for the Supramental Yoga?

Sri Aurobindo: The Shakti is not necessary for the Yoga: without the Shakti full knowledge, consciousness, power and Ananda can be attained. But if these elements are to be brought to and manifested in life then the Shakti is necessary. If there is no Shakti then he cannot bring down the knowledge, power, Ananda, etc. that are in him into life. He can, in that case, only prepare the way for the work to be done at a future time.

Disciple: Suppose a person aspiring for spiritual life marries, what would happen to him?

Sri Aurobindo: If such a man marries, three things might happen:

If it is an ordinary marriage he may be pulled down to the lower level of consciousness, apart from the cares, anxieties and responsibilities he may be burdened with. In that case he may lose his aspiration for the higher life and may be completely changed on account of the woman's influence on him.

He may be spiritually ruined altogether by the marriage.

Or, if he gets the woman of the right type it may be a great help to him.

You can write to D that Sri Aurobindo does not believe in marriage as it exists at present in society and as an institution. He does not ask a person to marry or not to marry; it is left entirely to the person concerned.

For a person who aspires for some kind of higher life it is common, especially for those who have a strong vital being, to have a tendency for vital enjoyment, and vital relation with a woman. Sri Aurobindo has no objection to this as an experience and perception. Only, in a yogi's life these have to be transformed into the movements of the Higher Nature.
21 JANUARY 1925

A letter from A was received. He wanted the following points to be answered:

The distinction between the Higher Knowledge and mental or intellectual knowledge.

The distinction between mental will and the higher Tapas-Shakti.

Ramakrishna says that one who wants God must give up everything for him. Should he follow this idea?

Sri Aurobindo: As to the first point you write to him that it is the Higher Knowledge — its Jyoti — which illumines the mind. The distinction between mental will and the higher Tapas-Shakti he cannot know at present as he has not been given the Yoga which is practised here. For doing this Yoga he has to decide finally what he intends to do when he goes out of jail. He may have to leave off his external activities. But that he must decide by referring to his inner being.

As to leaving everything for God, I do not know what Ramakrishna may have meant. But I want him to understand that he ought not to decide by what Ramakrishna said, or what I say, but by what he feels within his own being, in the inmost depth of his being.

What I feel is that A has mental ideas about spiritual things but does not seem to have turned his inner eye within himself. I do not want to call him away from the true demand of his inner being.

Disciple: A has been doing political work as you know. So, the question from him would be: What is the connection between Yoga and political work?

Sri Aurobindo: The present-day political activity is intensely Rajasic in its nature and its reconciliation with Yoga is not easy. In fact, all those who took to this Yoga had to give up political activity.

Disciple: Why should it be so? There is acceptance of life in this Yoga, is there not?

Sri Aurobindo: Yes, there is no rejection of life; you can say, life is accepted in this Yoga. But we regard the inner life as more important, the outer only as an expression, a form, of it.

Disciple: Can one not take up the outer action — say, political — in the Yoga?

Sri Aurobindo: External action can also be taken up in this Yoga but it must be in keeping with the inner life. The outside world regards all those who do this Yoga here as 'lost' to all work. But that is not the correct reading. It is not that we have no sympathy with the political aspirations of the country; only, we can't go into them in the Rajasic way.

We leave it to the Higher Power to do what She likes.

Disciple: But you yourself did political work.

Sri Aurobindo: Yes, I did it but it was done in the attitude I just now described — i.e. by leaving the work in the hands of the Higher Power.

Disciple: Suppose India accepts the Truth which the Yoga wants to bring down into life?

Sri Aurobindo: If the Truth which the Yoga wants to achieve is attained and if India accepts it, then it will give quite a new turn to Indian politics — different from European politics. It would be a profound change.

But that is a question which A will have to decide afterwards. For the present, A must find out why he wants the Yoga, whether he has a call — a true call. And the second question is whether he has the capacity. I do not know about his capacity but he requires, I believe, a long preparation.
15 SEPTEMBER 1925

Some questions were put to Sri Aurobindo about a sadhak in Chittagong who wanted to give Sadhana-initiation into Yoga to others.

Sri Aurobindo: X was never a great sadhak and he is not fit to give initiation.

He had some possibilities which were destroyed because of his vanity. He thought that he was a great sadhak and tried to pose as such.

He was self-willed and never used to pay attention to the instructions sent to him from Pondicherry. He had one idea in his mind: that everything that was coming to him was from Shakti or Kali, though he was repeatedly warned against it.

He could not distinguish between what was true and what came to him from the vital and the lower world.

At present he is completely under the control of vital suggestions and hallucinations with the erotic impulse behind them and all his saying that he is doing what I tell him and that "my concentration helps him" is false. It is the explanation given by those lower powers to justify their ways to him.

This Yoga is not a Tantric Yoga and so I can't do anything about the process he follows. There are things in the vital world which are both true and false and the sadhak of this path has to distinguish between them. The Vital is a world full of lustre and colour and hallucination which try to ape the Supramental movements. As I said the other day, it cinematographs the higher movements. It is also full of power.

If he wants to do this Yoga he must begin again; make his mind and vital being calm, give up all the movements of the ego and aspire for the Truth and nothing but the Truth.

Instead of trying to push ahead in Sadhana, it is better to give time to the preparation for Yoga which is the preliminary purification of the Adhar — the nature-mould.

( There was silence for some time)

It seems evident that X must have done some Sadhana in his previous life and must have acquired some powers then. He must have repressed his impulses and so they are having their satisfaction now.

Disciple: Was he brilliant before he began Yoga?

Sri Aurobindo: No. But after beginning it he showed mental capacity. Evidently, something opened up in him and his physical mind was not able to bear it. He might have been trying to set things right but when the uprush came he could not distinguish between the higher and the lower movements.

A letter from Y (who was also in Chittagong), was read, containing "an analysis of Yoga".

Sri Aurobindo: It is not all nonsense, though he has put the things pell-mell. It is very difficult to practise this Yoga if the outer instruments are not prepared to express the inner being. There are people who get something in their psychic being and immediately it tries to force its way out. But the outer members are not able to bear it and the whole thing breaks up.

Disciple: What will become of Y in his next life, — will his madness follow him?

Sri Aurobindo: He will have to work it out. The madness is working out sufficiently rapidly, so that he may begin next time with a better instrument.

Disciple: Would it be better, if he stopped these things?

Sri Aurobindo: In most people it is not the central being that finds expression. It is some minor personality which serves for the temporary purposes of life. The true central being is always behind.

Disciple: Can the central being never come up without Yoga?

Sri Aurobindo: Very few can know and express their central being without Yoga.

The vital appears brilliant and imitates the rapidity of the higher movement and creates false reflections of the Truth and can try to mislead the sadhak.

Disciple: Can it imitate the calm of the Supermind?

Sri Aurobindo: Oh yes. There are Asuric forces that are very calm. Do you think that the Asura is a fool? Sometimes, Tapasya is his chief weapon. Hiranyakashipu and Ravana were great Tapaswins. Doing good to humanity is one of the favourite weapons of the Asura. Of course, he seeks to do it in his own Asuric way. The Asuric Maya can take up any garb — even the pursuit of an ideal or sacrifice for some principle!
4 OCTOBER 1925

A letter from X's husband which raised certain general questions about the relation of man and woman in this Yoga. He wanted to exercise the conjugal right with his wife. Both had written to Sri Aurobindo separately for guidance.

The husband's argument: "Sri Aurobindo's Yoga is not a yoga of renunciation and even if renunciation was to be carried out I shall carry it out gradually. I am not able to control myself. I want to know: What is the relation between man and woman in this Yoga?"

Sri Aurobindo dictated the following by way of reply:

This is not a yoga of renunciation in the sense that one has to reject life or the world externally. But that does not mean that one has to give room to lower forces and allow them full play in their lower forms.

This is a Yoga of rising into the divine nature from the lower nature. What that higher nature is you will understand afterwards. You have to become fit for it. You can now see your lower nature, especially the vital play of Kama (lust) and Krodha (anger) etc., is essentially the functioning of the animal-man. You have to rise into the divine nature by rejecting the lower nature. How can you get the divine nature unless you conquer the nature of the animal-man in you? The first step has been given to you: you must learn to separate yourself as the Purusha, and look unmoved at all the play of Nature in you. You must externalise the play and see all its actions as outside yourself. You ought not to allow any mental justification for the play of the lower forces of the vital being. The Shuddhi — purification — necessary in this Yoga cannot be attained with the forces of lust and anger and there is no question of harbouring them.

(After a pause) In this matter, you must resort to simple thinking and simple action, leaving all mental complications and Shastric injunctions. You must not allow the intellect to play with them. Your ideas about Shastric injunctions are nothing else but justifications. Really it is the lower play of the vital being. In this rejection of the lower nature you ought to be ever alert, vigilant.

The ideal relation between man and woman in this Yoga you cannot at present understand. You have, first, to make yourself fit for it. Your own ideas of married life and Shastra etc., are dangerous and if you follow these ideas there is every chance of your fall from the Yoga. All of them are mental constructions. The first thing in a case where both man and woman are aspirants is to help each other in Sadhana. They must exchange their forces and help each other to rise into the Higher Consciousness.

Secondly, there is the question of love. What most people call 'love' is a superficial thing and mostly bound up with the vital craving of lust. That has to be completely rejected.

There is a relation deeper than that — it is of the soul. That relation comes from within by itself. It manifests itself in both as an ideal oneness — oneness in mind, oneness of the soul, oneness of self. That relation is Shanta, full of peace, wide, pure — Pavitra. In it there is no trace of vital lust and physical craving. There is also possible a relation of Purusha and Shakti between man and woman. But that relation is not social, it is not ordinary. Because one is married to a certain woman it does not follow that his wife is necessarily his Shakti.

So long as these relations are not understood and experienced by you another possible relation is that of friends. That is to say, you ought to live with your wife just as you would with a friend who has the same aim of life, without any other relation than that of friendship.

You must remove the misunderstanding from your mind about your wife that she does not love you, etc. She has an aspiration for the Yoga and therefore she wants to reject all the lower play of nature from herself and from you. You ought not to press her or induce her to fall from the path of Yoga. If you can't control yourself you should live separately and fight your nature.

You write about passivity and activity: you have to understand and know what they are. When one begins Yoga, naturally, all the forces on the mental, and especially on the vital plane, that are hostile to the Siddhi of this Yoga, are bound to rise and one must be active in rejecting them — what the Gita calls apramatta — because the Purusha is not only sākṣī but anumantā, one who gives consent. This activity of rejection must be always there. Even if you fall you must rise up again and again and fight.

Passivity merely means a calm inactive attitude of mind keeping it open to the higher influence and ready to accept the light, power, knowledge, Ananda that come from Above. It must be a prayerful mood so that the knowledge may come down. When the higher knowledge comes one ought not to allow the mind to get active with it, but must allow that knowledge to come more and more by keeping the mind passive.

Both passivity and activity are legitimate movements of this Yoga in the beginning. The highest, the true passivity will, of course, come afterwards. If you remain passive now, you will open yourself to all sorts of influences and accept all kinds of suggestions, ideas, etc., coming from outside, from the universal Nature. You will mistake them for those coming from the Higher Power.
7 OCTOBER 1925

Two letters containing some questions about Sadhana were received.

Sri Aurobindo: It is no use X trying to have the current of force at present. The Supramental Yoga is out of his reach at present. He seems to be puzzled as to what is 'life' and what is action. It does not mean only marriage and earning. He does not understand that Karma Yoga does not require any vast field. It is not necessary to become a prime minister or a millionaire to do Karma Yoga.

He speaks of Raja Yoga, — but in Raja Yoga also a certain purification of nature is required which is done by Yama and Niyama before the aspirant can succeed in meditation and attain Samadhi.

In this Yoga also something similar is to be done, though in a different manner. He has, first, to try to understand his own nature and get rid of egoistic motives from his actions and of desires from the vital being. He must try to acquire Samata and Sattwic balance. That is to say, he should reject lower motives and learn to act from higher motives and with a Sattwic temperament. All our actions proceed from a certain inner attitude and he has to see whether he can change the motive of desire for a higher one.

He can read the first few chapters of the Essays on the Gita and try to understand Karma Yoga. Some sort of Karma Yoga is the best preparation for this Yoga. He cannot get the current of the Higher Power now; he must make himself fit for the Higher Power. The real Shakti cannot come unless the Adhar is purified. She can force the way, but in that case there will be all confusion and the Adhar may break.
9 OCTOBER 1925

In a letter the question raised was: "Is not all action incompatible with Sri Aurobindo's Yoga?"

Sri Aurobindo: His idea that all action is incompatible with this Yoga is not correct. Generally, it is found that all Rajasic activity does not go well with this Yoga; for instance, political work. The reasons for abstaining from political activity are:

Being Rajasic in its nature, it does not allow that quiet and knowledge on the basis of which the work should really proceed.

All action requires a certain inner formation, an inner detached being. The formation of this inner being requires one to dive into the depth of the being, get to the true Being and then prepare the true Being to come to the surface. It is then that one acquires a poise — an inner poise — and can act from there. Political work by Rajasic activity which draws the being outwards prevents this inner formation.

The political field, together with certain other fields, is the stronghold of the Asuric forces. They have their eye on this Yoga, and they would try to hamper the Sadhana by every means. By taking to the political field you get into a plane where these forces hold the field. The possibility of attack in that field is much greater than in others. These Asuric forces try to lead away the sadhak from the path by increasing Kama and Krodha, and such other Rajasic impulses. They may throw him permanently into the sea of Rajasic activity.

He asks about the synthesis between Sadhana and action. In this Yoga such a synthesis is not necessary in the beginning. The sadhak in general, opens himself alternately to the Higher Power and to the ordinary life. It goes on like that for a long time. Then comes a time when the two powers oppose each other and then the need for synthesis arises.

But if the difficulty is only intellectual then it need not be solved now. In this Yoga intellect is not the chief instrument, — experience is primary. Of course, there is the intellectual side of Yoga which the mind of the sadhak must grasp as it would be helpful to him. But it is the experience which is the most important thing.
12 OCTOBER 1925

In a letter from Allahabad a question was asked: "Do you find that you are more energetic after practising Yoga than you were when you appeared for the I.C.S. examination?"

Sri Aurobindo turning to a disciple, asked the same question in a general form.

Disciple: I find that my experience is, perhaps, not encouraging.

Sri Aurobindo: Does it mean that you are less energetic now than before you began Sadhana?

( Turning to another disciple) What do you say?

Disciple: I find that it is not possible to put forth energy in the old way.

Sri Aurobindo: My experience is quite the reverse. I feel ten times more energetic than I was before Yoga.

Disciple: Are there times in Sadhana when one finds the energy flagging?

Sri Aurobindo: That is due to Tamas. The question is not of Tamas coming up. Even if Tamas came, why should the energy be absent?

Disciple: There are times when one can't put forth energy as one used to do.

Sri Aurobindo: That may be temporary.

Disciple: Did you find in your case a steady increase of energy with the practice of Yoga?

Sri Aurobindo: No, not steady. I was more energetic when I was working in politics than I had been before; when I took up Yoga I was more energetic than I had been in politics.

Disciple: There are times when one cannot do work that is expected of one.

Sri Aurobindo: Of course, one can't do what others demand of one. The question is whether you have the energy, never mind in what way it is put forth. For instance, in that house just before I began the Arya there was a period of six months in which there was a continual spiritual experience and I could not do any writing at that time. But that does not mean I was less energetic.

I could not have written the 64 pages of the Arya before without flagging. I give another instance: now I do not find it possible to make speeches as before. If I am asked to make speeches I would find myself very unenergetic.

Disciple: But you are making a speech once in the year!

Sri Aurobindo: That is not a speech! And even that Iam doing because X expects me to speak.

Disciple: So you are doing it under compulsion!

Sri Aurobindo: Almost! I would prefer to be silent!

Disciple: We know that; this time we have to thank Y.

Sri Aurobindo: Oh! I see, because he gave the points.

Disciple: I want to ask you one question: Is Instinct higher than Reason?

Sri Aurobindo: In what sense?

Disciple: In the sense that it is pure, that is, unmixed, direct, and automatic.

Sri Aurobindo: It is true within certain limits. The animal instinct is limited to a particular purpose. It is something ingrained in the being, something that is handed down to a particular species.

Disciple: There is a report on the behaviour of rats, in an American publication. It describes how the rats attacked a hanging basket full of eggs, formed a chain to drop them down, and how they carried away all the eggs.

Sri Aurobindo: This may shock some people — but the ordinary idea about the animal is, of course, absurd. They are much nearer to man than is generally supposed.

Disciple: I was asking about this kind of instinct.

Sri Aurobindo: It is not 'instinct' at all, it is intelligence.

Disciple: But the animals have no intelligence.

Sri Aurobindo: What do you mean? They have as much intelligence as men have. The behaviour and action of the rats just now described is a work of intelligence.

I told you, perhaps, how once I saw a spider. He wanted to balance his cobweb against some weight in order to support it. He put a blade of grass first, but found it was not heavy enough. So he went down and brought a small piece of gravel and with it balanced the web. Now, you can't call this instinct. It is intelligence. What we can say is that the animals have not got a developed mind. We can call this intelligence, vital intelligence or vital mind. It works very correctly within limits. But if you take the animal out of the field, in which its instinct is unerring, you will find that it stumbles even more than the rational mind.

The reason why the animal mind thinks correctly is that the animals have not got the struggle between the vital and the mental being that man has got.
21 OCTOBER 1925

The talk turned on the content of a letter by a sadhika who said in her letter that her husband was trying to justify the lower sexual impulse by quoting Shastra and also by saying that Sadhana ought to be done through Bhoga — enjoyment. He also complained that Sri Aurobindo's Yoga was more rigorous than even the path of Sannyas. He argued: "What is the use of a relation between man and woman if there is no sexual enjoyment?"

Sri Aurobindo: Tell her that the true relation between man and woman cannot be understood by them. They must advance a great deal before they can understand it. It is no use trying to understand it intellectually.

She must go on with her own Sadhana without caring to lift her husband. If he has something genuine in him he will come up. Everything depends upon him so far as he is concerned. He has something in him which is turned to Yoga but his vital being requires great purification. He has been given quite elementary practice. He has been asked to watch his nature as the Purusha and to reject the play of the lower nature. He can also seek help from Above. The element in his vital nature trying to justify the lower impulses by reasons and arguments is very dangerous.
2 NOVEMBER 1925

A letter from a gentleman putting questions about the iand the paramātmā and their relation and also about the experience of the Supermind.

Sri Aurobindo (with a smile) : You can ask him to read all the issues of the Arya where he will find solutions for all his questions.

Disciple: But he may say he does not know English!

Sri Aurobindo: Then he can wait till he has learnt it! (Laughter)

There was talk about the translation in Marathi of The Yoga and Its Objects. Sri Aurobindo was told some details about it.

Sri Aurobindo: I have no objection to my books being translated if they are written by people who know how to write.

Disciple: Unfortunately your books are like no-man's-land. This writer believes the refrain or burden of the book to be "Yoga is for humanity".

Sri Aurobindo: Yes, I think many people would be sorely disappointed if they came to know that I had already outgrown that 'humanity' stage. It is one of the great illusions.

Disciple: But, then, would nothing be done for humanity?

Disciple: He says it is a big illusion, don't you see?

Sri Aurobindo: Yes, it is one of the most powerful Sattwic illusions which people have. It has a very great hold.

Disciple: Do you mean to say that nothing can be done for humanity?

Sri Aurobindo: Why should anything be done?

Disciple (to another) : Do you feel left out as one of humanity? (Laughter)

Disciple: You are not outside the pale of humanity!

Sri Aurobindo: It is not the question whether one can do anything for humanity. The question is whether anything can be done. The difficulty is that people expect humanity to change by some sort of miracle into something which is not humanity.

Disciple: Not by a miracle.

Sri Aurobindo: Wouldn't you think it a miracle if all the 1500 or more millions of people that are living on the earth could be changed into something that is superhumanity?

Disciple: It would be a miracle, if it could be done.

Sri Aurobindo: Imagine the whole of humanity from Bernard Shaw to the maid servant being changed into something which is not humanity.

Disciple: But, then, do you think that humanity is not moving at all and that there has been no evolution up till now?

Sri Aurobindo: I don't say that. Humanity is moving itself. The only difficulty is that it has a tendency to come back to its starting point again and again! (Laughter)

Disciple: Suppose this time we succeed in the Yoga and the Supermind comes down into the physical; I do not expect it in one day but in course of time.

Sri Aurobindo: You mean Kalpas — cycles of ages — afterwards? Even then, do you suppose that the whole human race will be transformed suddenly into the Supramental race ?

Disciple: In that case nothing can be done for humanity. One can only write books for humanity.

Sri Aurobindo: I don't say that nothing is, or can be, done for humanity. What I say is that there is nothing radically altered, no fundamental change in humanity, in spite of all that has been done.

Time after time something comes down from Above, but again you find humanity the same as ever. Look at Christianity, all the millions in Europe who profess it. Do you think they believe in Christianity? Not even ten percent try to live out Christianity. That is the difficulty with humanity. Something comes down from Above. In order to make it available to the whole community you have to give it such a form as to make it suitable to all capacities and in that change the Truth gets mixed with their falsehood — so much so that it no longer remains what it was. Buddha came and tried and did not succeed, and I think any such effort would not succeed.

Disciple: Anatole France seems to hold that humanity is what it is and is going to be what it is. Perfection may come to man but humanity will remain what it is. True perfection is possible but it would be in something that is different from man.

Sri Aurobindo: Yes, you can give a religion or create a sect and be a prophet or something of the kind. But nothing will be really done.

Disciple: But when the Supermind comes down do you think that there would be no connection between man and Superman?

Sri Aurobindo: Idon't say there would be no connection. There is no reason why there would be no relation.

Disciple: But we want also to change human nature.

Sri Aurobindo: Yes, but, as is now admitted, such a radical change cannot be done in the human being. We can also call man the 'mental being', though it is a compliment which the average man does not deserve as he is hardly a 'mental being'. All the same we can say 'human consciousness' or 'the mental consciousness'. As a radical change in this mental consciousness cannot be brought about by the mind, we want to change it by something which is not mind, we call it Supermind. As man is removed from the animal, so would be the Superman from man.

Disciple: Would the Superman be as far from man as man from the monkey?

Sri Aurobindo: What do you mean by 'monkey'?

Disciple: The stage of consciousness before man evolved.

Sri Aurobindo: That does not seem to be the accepted theory now. They say that the monkey and ourselves are cousins. All the same I should like to think that man would be nearer to Superman than the animal is to man.

Disciple: It would mean that Supermind would work for humanity.

Sri Aurobindo: It is not exactly for humanity, it is for something which is more than humanity. It is bringing about a change from humanity to super-humanity. Of course, that change is to come in, and from, humanity, it is not to drop from heaven. But it would create something quite different from man.

Disciple: Would not such a change require a change in man's physical form?

Sri Aurobindo: Ican't say. But Ican say this that it would necessitate a change in the physical functions; they would have all to be transformed. Otherwise, this stupid body of man would be incapable of holding the Supramental Power.

Disciple: Yes, it is always constipated! (Laughter)

Then two questions were raised: 1. The nature of the Supramentalised body. 2. The nature of the economic organisation in the life of Supermen.

Sri Aurobindo: In the Supramental economic organisation you would not expect X to go and fish on the pier at Pondicherry. (Laughter)

This question about the nature of the Supramental body was answered by Théon. He was in France at that time. He said the Supramental body would be a 'body of light' — corps glorieux. He had a number of disciples some of whom were mathematicians and scientists. One of them brought the solution one day that the body of the superman would be a sphere! Théon said: "It may be, but it would be very inconvenient if people want to kiss each other!" (Laughter)

Disciple: Jokes apart, I want to know whether the human body would not cast its imperfection on the manifestation of the Spirit. Would not the Supermind require another form?

Sri Aurobindo: Another physical form may not be required. What I can say, at present, is that all the physical functions would have to be transformed. The present physical body is 'stupid' compared to what is required of it for Supramentalisation.
26 DECEMBER 1925

There was a letter from a sadhak at Chittagong describing his experience and asking for guidance.

Sri Aurobindo: You can write to him that the idea prevalent, but mistaken, at Chittagong is that Yoga means seeing visions and that it is something mysterious and miraculous, or receiving suggestions. This is a great mistake. The aim of Yoga is not seeing visions but to change the consciousness.

There are many kinds of visions. Some visions are only images, some are forms taken by our vital desires, or they are images of mental thoughts. Often they are our own creations; they do not correspond to any Truth. True visions are very rare and they can't be completely understood unless one has the right discernment and great purity in the being. I would like all people interested in our Yoga to understand this thing. Such visions as they have been seeing obviously show that they are creations of their vital desires that have taken form. Such visions have no value whatever from the point of view of Sadhana. In Yoga one has to be prepared for dry work which is very necessary: the purification of the entire being and then the discipline of self-mastery and self-control. He must reject those false visions. He must aspire for some more solid things.

There was reference made to Sri Aurobindo about the marriage of a disciples sister.

Sri Aurobindo: It seems she wants to marry; in that case it is no use trying to restrain her artificially, or trying to foist Sadhana on her when she is not willing. Let her choose out of the three proposals. About Yoga, if she has a call, a deep call, it will last and assert itself. It can never be lost. On the contrary, an artificial demand for Sadhana created by external pressure may be very bad for her. It may not last and would easily give way before the demands of the ordinary life and its impulses.

There was nothing of general interest during the interval. Some events may be noted:

A wire from Krishnashashi was received, informing Sri Aurobindo that he was dead. It was sent under the name 'Jyoti'. This wire was contradicted by Mohini from Chittagong.

A disciple from Madras sent a copy of the Theosophist. It contained lectures and the latest declaration by Mrs. Besant about Krishnamurty's avatarhood and the descent of the world-teacher in him.

Disciple: Did you read the Theosophist?

Sri Aurobindo: Yes, I made an unsuccessful effort. What she used to write before was readable and had some power. But this is rather hopeless.

Disciple: Did you read the book containing the account of so many past lives?

Sri Aurobindo: Iknow those visions. They are just what our Chittagong people are getting, they are full of imaginations. They are not visions that come to one, but those which one creates for oneself by pressure. One man told me that I have to close my eyes and begin to imagine I am in another's body and I shall be at once in that plane. I tried it once and saw it is very easy. You can construct the history of the world from the remotest past without much difficulty.

Disciple: Do these people do any Sadhana?

Sri Aurobindo: Yes, in their own way. But if a descent of a great Truth is to take place there must be a very solid preparation to hold it. That is a more important work than holding up somebody as the Avatar.
22 FEBRUARY 1926

A letter from Subhas Chandra Bose to Dilip Kumar Roy that appeared in the Prabartak of Chandernagore was read out. Subhas remarked in it that though he had great respect for Vivekananda he considered Sri Aurobindo more gabhīr — deeper — than the former. He accepted Sri Aurobindo as a genius and a great Dhyani, but thought that too long remaining away from 'active life' tends to onesided development and may help some few to become Supermen, but for the generality of men he would prefer the path of service and work.

Sri Aurobindo heard the contents of the letter and was glad that it was short.

Sri Aurobindo: I met X today and he told me that Madame Y who is a Theosophist and has some experiences in Yoga on the mental level is coming to India from France. She has an idea of regenerating India by settling some spiritually-minded Europeans in India.

She has got an illusion of work and many Europeans have got the same. They think that they can do spiritual work; with their ideas they come to India and get lost in the ocean that is India and fail to achieve anything substantial. They don't make any impression and even if something is done it is lost out of recognition after some time — you can't recognise what it was.

For ordinary men work is, of course, necessary, but one who wants to do 'divine work' must prepare himself. He must learn to be 'an instrument' first. All these Europeans have to learn that the work they take up is only a preparation for the divine work. They must know that it is not any mentally constructed work to which they must obstinately stick, if they want to be the instruments of God.

For instance, all these tall ideas like Madame Y's about regenerating India and taking up big schemes and being regarded as big workers and saviours have got a fascination. One who wants to do the divine work must learn to forget the difference between important and unimportant work, small work and great work, till the work that is intended is found by him.

Disciple: She would profit spiritually only if she learnt from her work and her experience. India has got her own Dharma and work for her has to be done in keeping with her Dharma.

Sri Aurobindo: She has another mania: getting inspiration for her work. I explained to X that it is not inspiration that comes always. You can drag down what your mind has chosen; your desire or your own idea, your impulse or even your own mental preference can reflect itself like that, and appear to you as coming from Above. One who wants to do divine works must first attain spiritual perfection. If one is sincere then generally he profits by such work. For instance, such a man will submit his inspiration to the test of hard physical experience. If it is found true there then it is true. But if the inspiration fails to come true in life then one can set himself on the right path if one is sincere. But what people generally do is that if the inspiration fails they get another and then another explaining away each one to themselves.

There are people who follow up their intuition or inspiration and turn out solid work like J. C. Bose.

Disciple: At the time of the non-cooperation Dr. P. C. Ray came forward enthusiastically and joined the movement. But J. C. Bose said that if he was to do service to India he could only do it through his scientific work.

Some medical students left their studies, went to work in the villages and came back within a short time shorn of all emotional enthusiasm.

Sri Aurobindo: What do they mean by village organisation? Have they any idea? They always cite the example of Russia, but they don't know how the Russians worked.

If you want to work in the villages you must leave off all idea that it will be done very soon. It is a very laborious work. It can't be done by lecturing. Political agitation has its law and solid work has its own law. Our people mix up the two things. Political agitation requires you to put up a new idea before the public; then you go on hammering out that idea, wait till it catches the publics imagination and gets connected with its vital interest. Then you wait for the psychological moment when you can get to your objective. It is useful in a nations life.

But solid work is quite different. In Russia the workers settled in villages, some as doctors, some as teachers doing their work and trying to raise the life there, bringing new light and new awakening. It is to be done slowly. The idea that somehow it will get done in a year or two — like "Swaraj in one year" — is all egoistic ignorance. Solid work is to be done under the law of the physical plane. The Russians waited patiently for years together and then their organisation got slowly recognised by the Government and then after a long wait came the Revolution.

How do you expect villagers to trust every young irresponsible man who claims to do good to them? If you go on working for years then you may get into their confidence and may be able to achieve something. All these ideas of theatrical success and lightning flash-like work are most impracticable. You have to stick on to your work through all difficulties. It requires patience.

Disciple: At Sajod, in Broach District of Gujarat, educated young men have gone and settled in the village and after nearly 15 years they are able to inspire confidence in the villagers about their work.

Sri Aurobindo: That is the only way if one wants to work in the villages. Then only a new life can gradually grow in them. They can then combine into organised units.
23 MARCH 1926

K had written a letter to S containing an account of his Sadhana after receiving Sri Aurobindo's last letter and sent some questions to be answered by Sri Aurobindo to which no reply was sent for many days. Whenever Sri Aurobindo was reminded he said, "I am not inclined to lecture on the psychic being."

Today he inquired whether there were any important letters unanswered. He was told about K's letter.

Sri Aurobindo: Do you want me to lecture on the psychic being?

Disciple: Some general hints may be given, if you like.

Sri Aurobindo: Firstly, when the psychic awakens you grow conscious of your own soul, you know your true being. You no longer commit the mistake of identifying yourself with the mental or the vital being, you do not mistake them for the soul.

Secondly, when it is awakened, the psychic being gives the sadhak the true Bhakti for God or for the Guru. That devotion is quite different from mental and vital devotion.

In the mind one may have admiration for the intellectual ideas of someone, or one may have mental appreciation for some great intellect. But if it is merely mental, it does not carry matters very far; it is not sufficient by itself. It does not open the whole of the inner being; it only establishes a mental contact. Of course, there is no harm in having that. When K came here he had that mental admiration for what I have written in the Arya. One can get something from that kind of mental contact, but it is not what one can get by being in relation with the psychic being. I do not, for a moment, want to suggest that there was no truth in his Bhakti, but there was much mixture in it and even what was mental and vital was very much exaggerated.

When he began the Yoga he had certain capacities. Of course, he was not half as tall as he thought himself to be. But if he had not exaggerated his capacities he would have been, by this time, farther than he is today.

The vital devotion demands and demands. It imposes its own conditions. It says to God: "You are so great, therefore I worship you; and now satisfy this desire and that condition of mine; make me great; make me a great sadhak, a great Yogin, etc." It does not use this language of course, but that is what is behind it. It assumes many justifying forms and comes to the sadhak in various ways.

The unillumined mind also surrenders to the Truth but it makes its own conditions. It says to the Truth: "Satisfy my judgment and my opinions." It demands that the Truth should cast itself in mental forms. The vital being insists that the Truth should throw itself into its own movement of force. The vital being pulls at the Higher Power; it pulls at the vital being of the Guru. Both the mind and the vital beings have got an arrière pensée — a mental reservation in their surrender.

But the psychic Bhakti is not like that. Because the soul is in contact with the Divinity behind, it is capable of true Bhakti. The psychic being has what is called ahaitukī bhakti, devotion without any motive. It does not make any demands, it makes no reservations in its surrender.

The psychic being knows how to obey the Truth in the right way. It can give itself up fully to God or to the Guru; and because it gives itself up truly it receives also truly.

When the psychic being comes to the surface it feels sad when the mental or the vital being is making a fool of itself. That sadness is purity offended. When the mind is playing its own game, or when the vital being is carried away by its impulses, it is the psychic being which says: "I do not want these things; what am I here for, after all? I am here for the Truth and not for these things." Psychic sadness is again different from mental dissatisfaction or vital sadness or physical depression.

If the psychic being is strong it makes itself felt in the mental and the vital beings, and forces them to change. But if it is weak, the mental and the vital take advantage of its sadness and use it even to their own advantage. A weak psychic being is often an affliction.

Take the case of X. He has a well-developed intellectual being; but his vital is often quite different in its character. At times the psychic being in his case used to force itself to the surface and throw everything into disorder. In Y's case it was the vital being that dictated to the psychic being. To the protests of the psychic being the vital says: "Yes, yes, what you say is all right, but I am also right and what I do is right and necessary."

When the psychic being is weak it casts only an influence occasionally and then retires into the background.

Disciple: But you said just now that the psychic being knows everything and is in communication with the Truth; then why should it be weak? Why can it not force the other parts of nature to obey it?

Sri Aurobindo: If the psychic being is not fully awake, it does not come to the surface. It is very much behind in most people, and when it cannot come fully to the surface I call it 'weak', not that the psychic being itself is weak. It has got everything in it, but when it can't bring it forward it is called weak.

Disciple: Is the psychic being the same as what is called Atman?

Sri Aurobindo: The Atman generally means what you imply in English by the word Spirit. It is self-existent, conscious, the ānandamaya Being, the Purusha. The Atman is the same in all; it is that which is behind all the manifestation of Nature.

Disciple: Has it any features?

Sri Aurobindo: It has no features. The only thing that can be said about it is: Sat, Chit, Ananda.

Disciple: Does it indicate the passive or the active state of the Being?

Sri Aurobindo: Generally it is used to imply the passive state, but sometimes it is used for both. The psychic being is not the same as the Atman. It is what corresponds to the European idea of 'soul'. The Western occultists recognise, at least they used to recognise, three things: Spirit, soul, body. The Spirit corresponds to the Atman, and the soul to the psychic being. It is the Purusha hṛdguhāyām — the soul in the cave of the heart.

Disciple: Is the aṇguṣṭha mātraḥ puruṣaḥ, spoken of in the Upanishad the same as the psychic being?

Sri Aurobindo: It may be. I think the psychic being was meant by the phrase, iśvaraḥ sarvabhūtānām hṛddeśe — the Lord seated in the heart of creatures.

Disciple: Is not the psychic being the direct portion of the Divine here? If so, is it the same as the Jiva?

Sri Aurobindo: The Jiva is something more than the psychic being. The psychic being is behind the heart; while the Jiva is high above, connected with the Central Being. It is that which on every level of consciousness becomes the Purusha, the Prakriti and the personalities of Nature. The psychic being, one may say, is the soul-personality. The psychic being most purely reflects the Divine in the lower triplicity of mind, life and body. There are four higher levels: Sat, Chit, Ananda and Vijnana; they are in Knowledge, while below in the three levels — mind, life and body — there is a mixture of ignorance and knowledge. The psychic being is behind the mind, life and body; it is most open to the higher Truth; that is why it is indispensable for the manifestation of the Divine.

The psychic being alone can open itself completely to the Truth. This is so because the movements of the lower parts — mind, life and body — are full of defects, errors and mixtures and, however sincere they may be and however hard they may try to transform themselves into movements of the Truth, they cannot do it unless the psychic being comes to their help. Of course, these lower parts have their own sincerity.

When the psychic being awakens it becomes easy for the sadhak to distinguish from within between Truth and falsehood, and also to throw out from the nature any wrong movement.

You may write to K one more point: The psychic being refuses to be deceived by appearances. It is not carried away by falsehood. It refuses to be depressed by falsehood, nor does it exaggerate the truth of what it sees. For example, even if everybody in the world around says: 'There is no God', the psychic being refuses to believe it. It only says: 'I know', and also, 'I know because I feel'.

As I said, the psychic being is behind the emotional being in the heart, and when it is awakened it throws out the dross from the emotional being and makes it free from sentimentalism and the lower play of vital emotions. But that is not the dryness of the mind, nor the exaggeration of the vital feelings, it gives the just touch to each emotion.

Disciple: Could one say that in the planes of consciousness above the mind all is the same — the psychic being and the Atman, etc.?

Sri Aurobindo: If you mean "Everything is One" then it merely comes to the old Adwaitavada of Shankaracharya. Really speaking, it is not a matter for the mind to decide. It is a matter of experience. In a certain experience you find that "All is One" and Shankara is right. But there are other experiences in which the Vishishtadwaita and even the Dwaita finds justification. Mind only cuts, differentiates, analyses, represents. You can't push these questions too far with the mind, otherwise you bring in the old quarrel of the philosophers. You can't say: "It is that", or "It must be like this", or "It can't be anything else"; for, it may be all these things at the same time. You can't approach the Highest with thought and express it in speech. Of course, you can express it, but then you diminish it also.

True knowledge is not attained by thinking. It is what you are; it is what you become; that is to say, you have the knowledge because you are That. That is the reason why I insist on the attainment of the Supermind as the condition for the experience of the highest Truth, because the mind cannot really know it. In the Supermind thoughts convey different aspects of the same Truth, — so different, indeed, that the first aspect is the diametrically opposite of the last — and they are all thrown into the One.

If you have the knowledge by identity you can easily get at my thoughts and my meaning. But I find that the same thing spoken to all carries a different meaning to each.

The subject was continued at lunch-time.

Sri Aurobindo: In the letter you can explain to K what the psychic feelings are. They are not the same as what ordinary men experience as sentiments and feelings. For example, the ordinary sentimental pity is not the same as what is called 'psychic compassion'. The latter is a much deeper compassion than pity. So also 'psychic love' is not the same as what generally passes for love. There is an unselfishness in psychic love; it is always free from all demands — it has no vital claims. Even psychic 'unselfishness,' is not the same as the ordinary unselfishness. There is an unselfishness which plays on the surface and shows itself off. It becomes philanthropy— paropakāra. But the psychic counterpart of it sees the need of the other person and just satisfies it.

Lastly, lest he should think that the psychic being is something weak and inert, let him understand that the presiding Deity — the adhiṣṭhātṛ devatā — of the psychic plane is Agni. It is the Divine Fire of aspiration. When the psychic being is awakened the God of the plane is also awakened. And even if the whole being is impure it is this Agni which intervenes, removes the obstacles in the way and consumes all the impurities of the being.
21 AUGUST 1926

There was a letter from a political prisoner who argued with a sadhak here about Work and Sadhana. He held that work should be done as sadhana for one could get perfection through work. He quoted the Gita: yogaḥ karmasu kauśalam — yoga is cleverness or efficiency in doing action.

Sri Aurobindo: So he thinks that Kaushalam in Karma is Yoga, does he? In that case any clever man, say an expert financier, must be a yogi!

We also thought once when we were doing work that perfection would one day come through 'action' and we found that it was not possible. We had to give up action in that sense. It does not mean that we give up all action. All of us are doing something or the other here. We have to do action as a sort of exercise — not for its own sake, but as a help to the inner growth.

Disciple: What are the limits of such work?

Sri Aurobindo: The limit is that the work ought not to be allowed to interfere with your Yoga. Suppose you take up a work which leaves no time for Sadhana — you can't take it up. That is to say, a work which demands all your attention and energy whichyou have to do as a Kartavya — something that should be done — that work cannot be undertaken by you.

Then there are works that have got a diferent Dharma; for example, politics. It is on a different plane and you can't do it successfully with this Yoga.

In this Yoga you have to be prepared to cut yourself away from what you consider your work and your creation, when necessary; you have to be merciless in throwing old things away. That is really the meaning of Nishkama Karma — that you must have no attachment to anything.

Disciple: Does not a stage come when it becomes necessary to give up all action?

Sri Aurobindo: You cannot make a general rule like that. Some may have to give up all action temporarily, — but for others it may not be necessary at all. I myself have been doing work constantly through the Arya and other things. And I stopped the Arya when I found that I had to put myself out too much, — so to say, externalise too much. The second reason was that I was required to be drawn within myself in order to develop certain experiences, so that the energy might be used for inward work. In a certain sense I can say that I never stopped doing work — even political work.

Disciple: In a sense! In what sense? I want to have some idea about it.

Sri Aurobindo: It is not so difficult as you think; one can put out his force to support certain movements and oppose others.

Disciple: Is that work confined to India?

Sri Aurobindo: It was confined to India in the beginning but now it is not confined to India.

At first I was not very successful, — very often it seemed to produce no result at all and I found that the work was done afterwards in quite another way than what I had expected or insisted. The same result came but it arrived in another way. The reason, probably, was that I used to put too much vital force with the Power. Of course, the vital is quite essential, but now it is pure and subtle vital force.

Disciple: You did it for what purpose — as something necessary or as an exercise?

Sri Aurobindo: It was shown as something that was to be done. It was not from the Supermind, of course. If it was from there then the full knowledge would be there from the beginning.

I did not know what was going to happen. I simply was shown the thing that was to be done and did it.

Disciple: How did you come to know that a certain thing is to be done?

Sri Aurobindo: Through the Higher Mind.

Disciple: Are there movements or persons, through whom youare working in Indian politics?

Sri Aurobindo: Yes. At one time it was X; Ieven worked through Y for a short time.

Disciple: Did you work upon the course of events of the world war?

Sri Aurobindo: It was so difficult to have sympathy with either side. But it would have been a great disaster if Germany had won.

Disciple: How? Indians wished Germany to win.

Sri Aurobindo: It was merely due to their hatred of the British. When the Germans were marching upon Paris I felt something saying, "They must not take Paris." And as I was consulting a map I almost felt the place where they would be stopped.

It is curious that several things that my mind was hammering at got done after I had dropped the idea altogether. At one time I had an idea that France must get back Alsace-Lorraine. It was almost an obsession with me and when I had ceased to think about it, the thing got done.

Disciple: Can it be due to the element of desire in the working?

Sri Aurobindo: Yes. You must have no desire. There is no question of 'success' also. There is a certain possibility and you have to make an attempt to work it out disinterestedly like a Yogi.

Disciple: What about Russia? It seems to have gone the wrong way.

Sri Aurobindo: How do you mean? It has gone the way that was intended. There is nothing good or bad, or moral or immoral. The question is: "Was it intended ?" It may be accompanied by so many results — good, bad and indifferent. The question is: "What is intended from Above ?"

The experience of humanity would have remained incomplete without the experiment in Russia. Now they have got the form. It depends upon the Russians what they will do with it.

I find it always difficult to work in Indian politics. The difficulty is that the vessels don't hold the Power, they are so weak. If the amount of force that is spent on India were spent on a European nation you would find it full of creative activities of various kinds. But here, in India, it is like sending a current of electricity through a sleeping man. He suddenly starts up, begins jerking and throwing his arms and feet about and then drops down again. He is not fully awake.

Disciple: What is it due to?

Sri Aurobindo: Due to tremendous Tamas. Don't you feel it all around, that Tamas? It is that which frustrates all efforts.

Disciple: What has brought it about?

Sri Aurobindo: It is the result of various causes. It was already settling — I mean, the forces of disintegration and inertia — before the British came. And after their coming the whole Tamas has settled like a solid block. There must be some awakening before something substantial can be done. Otherwise, India has got very good men; you had Tilak, Das, Vivekananda — none of them an ordinary man and yet you see the Tamas there.

Disciple: Is there any truth in the idea that every great Vibhuti who brings anything new into manifestation builds, first of all, what is called Yogapitha — a seat of Yoga? Each man who goes by his path reaches that Yogapitha and each sadhak has his place there. When once such a Pitha is made then anyone who comes afterwards finds it very easy to reach it because there is a passage already made.

Sri Aurobindo: I can tell you I am building nothing over there. I do not know what is to come. If there is anything in the Supramental I don't know it. You are not always allowed to know it. It is a plane where you find "what is" — there is no necessity to build or construct anything there.

I know some people make such constructions as the Yogapitha and so on. One can always find these things, because many things from the mental plane are always trying to realise themselves here. These constructions are generally on the mental plane and they may even have some truth behind them — not in the forms and constructions themselves. But even where there is some truth behind them it gets mixed up with many other things which sometimes falsifies the truth behind it.

Disciple: Perhaps all sorts of vital forces come and take advantage of it.

Sri Aurobindo: Yes. It is for this reason that I am not for rushing into work at once. Such a thing would not be the expression of the Truth. We have to wait till the Truth finds its own expression through us. I myself got the idea of the Supramental after ten years of Sadhana. The Supramental does not come in the beginning but at the end. It is a progressive Truth.

Disciple: Do you remember a vision Bibhuti-babu once had?

Sri Aurobindo: No.

Disciple :He saw a Yogapuri — a city of Yoga — in which there were different circles of sadhaks round a Guru in the centre of each group. Bibhuti wanted to join the circle but he was not allowed because he had not the password. There were watchmen also.

Sri Aurobindo: It looks more of the vital plane than anything else. There are people who get a symbolic vision and when they see the work not accomplished they generally see it as an unfinished building, or a place where workmen are still working. That does not correspond to any building in the Supramental. That is only a symbolic way of representing the Yoga and its condition and even at that it is not exact but gives only a general idea.

Do you refer to Chandernagore when you speak about the vital forces?

Disciple: Yes.

Sri Aurobindo: At the time I had some construction in my mind. Of course, there was something behind it which I knew to be true. Even then I was not sure that it would work out successfully. Anyway, I wanted to give it a trial and gave that idea to Motilal. Then he took up the idea and, as you know, he took it up with all his vital being and in an egoistic way. So the vital forces found their chance. They tried to take possession of the work and of the workers.

It is after several such lessons that I had to give up the idea of rushing into work. This Yoga is not a cut-out system. It is a growth by experience.

Disciple: Did you ever put your power against it?

Sri Aurobindo: No. I did nothing of the kind. The only thing I did was to put the Force so that those who were worth anything should be drawn out of it. I have forgotten all about it. In fact, I have long ago put away Chandernagore from my atmosphere. There was nothing of the Supramental there.
27 JANUARY 1939

This evening a very feeling letter written by Vivekananda in 1900 from California to Miss Josephine MacLeod was read to Sri Aurobindo. The relevant points in it are here reproduced.

Alameda, California

18th April 1900

...After all, Joe, I am only the boy who used to listen with rapt wonderment to the wonderful words of Ramakrishna under the Banyan at Dakshineshwar. That is my true nature,... doing good and so forth are all superimpositions. Now I again hear his voice; the same old voice thrilling my soul. Bonds are breaking — love dying, work becoming tasteless — the glamour is off life....

Yes, I come. Nirvana is before me. I feel it at times, the same infinite ocean of peace, without a ripple, a breath.

...Since the beginning of this year, I have not dictated anything in India. You know that.... I am drifting again... in the warm heart of the river! I dare not make a splash with my hands or feet — for fear of breaking the marvellous stillness, stillness that makes you feel sure it is an illusion!

Behind my work was ambition, behind my love was personality, behind my purity was fear, behind my guidance the thirst of power! Now they are vanishing and I drift. I come! Mother... a spectator, no more an actor...

...things are seen and felt like shadows....

Vivekananda

Disciple: The question is: "Is Vivekananda expressing only a passing mood because of his innate preference for Vairagya or was ambition really an element mixed up in his work?" I always felt that there was a double strain in his nature, — he was drawn between work and Sadhana.

Disciple: It is quite understandable that he observed some ambition lurking in his work. I do not think it is only a passing mood. Simultaneously with the Higher Consciousness one can see these things in one's nature.

Sri Aurobindo: These things, like ambition and so on, are not easily removed. They remain in the nature and are difficult to get rid of. Even when the Higher Consciousness comes they can continue with the lower nature.

Disciple: But he says in his writings and speeches that he was conscious of a Higher Power driving him into activity.

Sri Aurobindo: Quite possible; he was conscious of such a Power driving him in spite of his weakness, but that does not mean that his own ambition did not mix with the working of the Power.

Disciple: But later on in his letter he speaks of being freed after death or "freed in the body". That implies that he did not attain liberation till then!

Sri Aurobindo: There are two kinds of liberations: one is when you drop the body, that is to say, you may have attained liberation in consciousness yet something in the nature continues in the old bondage and that ignorance is usually supported by the body-consciousness. When the body drops, the man becomes entirely free or liberated. Another kind of liberation is what is called Jivan Mukti — one realises the liberation even while remaining in the body.

Disciple: But I believe there is a distinction between Videha Mukti and Jivan Mukti.

Sri Aurobindo: No. Jivan Mukti is the same as Videha Mukti. The example of Janaka is usually given and the current idea is that Jivan Mukti is more difficult to attain than the liberation that is attained either by renunciation or by giving up the body.

Disciple: Souls like Vivekananda come down for a specific work in this world and after doing their work they again ascend to their high status. Is this true?

Sri Aurobindo: Yes. There is a plane of liberation from which beings can come down here and perhaps that is what Ramakrishna meant by saying that there are Nitya Mukta souls — souls who are eternally liberated — who can go up and down the ladder of existence.

Disciple: Can they not evolve further on their own plane?

Sri Aurobindo: No.

Disciple: So there is no evolution on the other planes?

Sri Aurobindo: No. On the other planes there are only types and they cannot evolve. If they want to evolve to a condition higher than theirs they must take birth here on earth, that is to say, take a human body. Even the gods are compelled to take human birth if they want to evolve.

Disciple: Why should the gods want to evolve? They must be feeling quite happy in their own state.

Sri Aurobindo: They may get tired of their happiness, and may want something higher, for example, they may want Nirvana.

Disciple: But then they may get tired of Nirvana! (Laughter)

Sri Aurobindo: There is no one in Nirvana to get tired! A was asking me the same question: "Who has the experience of Nirvana, if there is no being in that state ?" The answer is: "Nobody has it. Something in you drops off and Nirvana takes its place." In fact, there is no "getting" but blotting out of "what one is". A was probably thinking that he would be sitting with his mental personality somewhere looking at Nirvana and saying: "Ah! this is Nirvana!" The reply is: "So long as you are there, no Nirvana can be." One has to get rid of all attachments and all personalities before Nirvana can come and that is extremely difficult for one attached to his mental personality like A.

Disciple: If Nirvana is such a negative state, what is the difference between one who has it and one who has not?

Disciple: From the point of view of Nirvana there is no difference ! (Laughter)

Sri Aurobindo: Yes. You find the difference because it is you who get blotted out in Nirvana and not anybody else.

(After a pause) This letter makes at least something precise about Vivekanandas experience because what he speaks of here is the condition of Nirvana accompanied by a sense of illusion of the world.

Disciple: This division of consciousness into two, one feeling fundamentally free and the other imperfect or impure is a very common experience.

Sri Aurobindo: It is not only common, it is the ordinary experience, and in order that one may be able to act without ambition one should be able to take action lightly. That is to say, one should not be perturbed if it is done or not done. It is something like the Gita's "inaction in action" and yet one must act, as the Gita says. The test is that even if the work is taken away or destroyed it must make no difference to the condition of your consciousness.

Disciple: Nirvana is a fundamental spiritual experience, is it not?

Sri Aurobindo: Nirvana, as Iknow it, is a necessary experience in order to get rid of the nature-personality which is subject to ignorance. You cease to be the small individual ego in a vast world. You throw away that and become the One in Nirvana.

Nirvana is a passage — for passing into a condition in which your true individuality can be attained. That individuality is not a small, narrow and limited self contained in the world, but is vast and infinite and can contain the world within itself; you can remain in the world and yet be above it, so to say. To get rid of the separative personality in nature Nirvana is a powerful experience.

Disciple: Does one realise oneself as an individual, that is to say, as the true Jiva after Nirvana?

Sri Aurobindo: One realises oneself as the One in all, and also the One as Many and yet that One is also He.

Disciple: That is what you have called "multiple unity".

Sri Aurobindo: Yes.

Disciple: In our Yoga we accept life as real.

Sri Aurobindo: That is to say, you have to give life a place in the Reality.

Disciple: And we are supposed or expected to do everything for you and the Divine Mother. But in our nature we are full of ego and ignorance. So our surrender is also full of ego.

Sri Aurobindo: But you are supposed to make the surrender without the ego-sense. The law is that you should get rid of attachment and desire in your surrender.

Disciple: But there are people who want to force their attitude and ideas on others.

Sri Aurobindo: These are the people who have the idea of our work, our Ashram. That is a form of ego and that must go.

Disciple: They even want to use physical force to make others accept you as the Guru and Avatar. (Laughter)

You know what happened to X, who is a friend of Y when he came here.

Sri Aurobindo: Yes, and X could contact the Consciousness only when he had gone from here.

This kind of thing is a great difficulty. There are some people here who, I believe, cant help propagandising. When R came here he was able to feel something here behind all the activities and he was progressing in his own way quite well. But one lecture from Y and the whole thing was upset.

Disciple: I suppose this sort of thing disturbs your work very much.

Sri Aurobindo: Oh, always. Instead of allowing the man to proceed on his own lines there is an effort to force things from viewpoints to which he is not accustomed. It always interferes with the work.

Disciple: Most probably, the man revolts and turns against the Yoga.

Sri Aurobindo: Either he shuts himself, or gets quite false ideas about Yoga.

Disciple: Something should be done, I think, to stop V from carrying on the propaganda.

Sri Aurobindo: Do you think he can be stopped? I have tried and found that nothing makes any impression. (Laughter)

Disciple: He is giving lectures.

Sri Aurobindo: I thought he was already a kind of Guru. (Laughter)

Disciple: He explains everything on the blackboard.

Sri Aurobindo: What! Explaining the Brahman on the blackboard ! (Laughter)

Disciple: One day while V was on gate-duty Amrita told him that the Mothers instruction to all sadhaks on gate-duty is that they should not sit on the chair or read or write while on duty.

Sri Aurobindo: Yes, it was true. We know N and others used to continue sitting on the chairs and reply to visitors.

Disciple: When Amrita had given the instructions he asked V why he was not carrying them out. V said: "That is my difficulty." (Laughter)

Sri Aurobindo: If you tell these people to go somewhere else and start an Ashram of their own, they wont do that.

Disciple: But when I put the question of difficulty to you it referred to my inner difficulties, — these were not meant, I am afraid. I was only recounting my difficulty in making the surrender.

Sri Aurobindo: And I was recounting mine! (Laughter)

Disciple: It is very difficult for a man like me to accept what these people want one to accept. I can accept you as the guide and Guru. But I must have my spiritual experience to believe them.

Sri Aurobindo: It is not always necessary to have the experience in order to believe in a thing. There are many people who believe on faith before they realise. But the difficulty comes when you want to force your faith on others. One can say: "I believe that so and so is an Avatar." But one can't say: "If you don't believe in him I will beat you." (Laughter) Then there are others who want to go into the Yoga with their families. There are husbands who get angry with their wives because they can't take to Yoga with them. (Laughter)

Disciple: They want to go to heaven with their family like Yudhishthira.

Sri Aurobindo: Going to heaven with the family may be possible, but not into Yoga. In the pursuit of a religious life you can have budo, budi, doojanate — old man, old woman, the two together — as D. L. Roy says.

Disciple: Yes. Then the atmosphere becomes harmonious at home.

Sri Aurobindo: Then there are some like V who tell a newcomer, when he is refused admission, to stick on!

Disciple: Yes, he gives his own instance and says it was a case of test. Test of faith! "If you have faith you will be admitted."

Sri Aurobindo: In most cases the people who persist are not those who have a real call for the Yoga from something deep in them. In most cases it is obstinacy. I particularly remember one case in which the obstinacy was wonderful. There are others in whom the desire to come and remain here is a mere surface movement, while in others it is there because they are lunatics or eccentrics. Even if you tell them to seek another Guru they won't listen to you!

There was a pause as some disciples left the room.

Disciple: But this letter of Vivekananda is a very sincere letter. It is easy to understand his difficulty. One cannot have freedom from ambition and other weaknesses unless one has the dynamic presence of the Divine all the time, or readily available whenever needed.

Sri Aurobindo: Yes. That is one way; or, as Isaid, if you can establish peace, equality and calm right down to your physical consciousness, so that nothing in you stirs whatever happens, then you can be free from ambition.

These things, as I said, are very difficult to get rid of. When I had the Nirvana experience at Baroda I thought at that time that I had no ambition left — at least personal ambition — in the work that I was doing for the country. Then I used to hear a voice within me telling me all about my inner movement. When I reached Calcutta I heard this voice pointing out things within me which showed that there was personal ambition of which I was till then quite unconscious. So, you see, these things can hide for a very long time.

It is like the contest for the Congress Presidentship in which both sides maintain that it is not ambition that is moving them, but sense of duty, call of the cause, principles, etc.! (Laughter)
6 FEBRUARY 1939

Lajpat Rai's letter to G. D. Birla

There are four main points brought out here from the letter:

Why act? What is the meaning of action ?

How can a perfect all-merciful, all-powerful God create such a world full of misery, suffering, poverty?

There is no use praying to God because prayers are only for consoling ourselves.

I act simply because I can't help doing actions.

Lajpat Rai now seems to accept the 'illusion' theory as the explanation while he combated it for the whole of his life. He was a prominent leader of the Arya Samaj, and a monotheist.

Disciple: What is the explanation of Lajpat Rai's attitude?

Sri Aurobindo: Generally it is tāmasic vairāgya, if it is due to a sense of failure in life. Most people get this kind of Vairagya when they act for 'success' and fail. Failure and frustration lead to what is called smashāna vairāgya, a temporary state of world-disgust.

But in his case, perhaps, it is Sattwic disgust. To the mind at this stage everything seems impermanent, fleeting, and the old motives of action are no longer sufficient. It may be the result of his spiritual development through his actions in life. It is mind turning to know things. Gautama Buddha saw human suffering and he asked: "Why this suffering?" and then "How to get out of it?" That is sattvic vairāgya. Pure sattvic vairāgya is when one gets the perception of the littleness of everything personal — actions, thoughts, etc., and when one sees the vast world, eternal time and infinite space spread out before oneself and feels all human action as if it were nought.

The same truth is behind the proverb: "It will be the same a hundred years hence." And it is true so far as the personal aspect of action is concerned.

Disciple: Can it be said that personal actions and other personal things have an importance in so far as through them an impersonal consciousness, or a divine purpose, works itself out?

Sri Aurobindo: Yes; in the impersonal aspect even a small personal action may have a significance. Personal actions have an importance in the evolution of the individual. But it is difficult to persuade the ordinary men to take this view.

Disciple: Lajpat Rai, who has been known as an Arya Samajist and therefore a theist, seems to doubt even the existence of God in this letter.

Sri Aurobindo: That does not matter. It only means he wants to understand the way of God's working, the nature of this world, etc.
***
I — On Books ON MEDICINE



questions, comments, suggestions/feedback, take-down requests, contribute, etc
contact me @ integralyogin@gmail.com or via the comments below
or join the integral discord server (chatrooms)
if the page you visited was empty, it may be noted and I will try to fill it out. cheers



--- OBJECT INSTANCES [0]


--- PRIMARY CLASS


chapter

--- SEE ALSO


--- SIMILAR TITLES [0]


2.02 - On Letters
select ::: Being, God, injunctions, media, place, powers, subjects,
favorite ::: cwsa, everyday, grade, mcw, memcards (table), project, project 0001, Savitri, the Temple of Sages, three js, whiteboard,
temp ::: consecration, experiments, knowledge, meditation, psychometrics, remember, responsibility, temp, the Bad, the God object, the Good, the most important, the Ring, the source of inspirations, the Stack, the Tarot, the Word, top priority, whiteboard,

--- DICTIONARIES (in Dictionaries, in Quotes, in Chapters)



--- QUOTES [0 / 0 - 0 / 0] (in Dictionaries, in Quotes, in Chapters)



KEYS (10k)


NEW FULL DB (2.4M)


*** NEWFULLDB 2.4M ***


--- IN CHAPTERS (in Dictionaries, in Quotes, in Chapters)



0

   1 Integral Yoga






change font "color":
change "background-color":
change "font-family":
change "padding": 99956 site hits